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Is anyone using tapeless cameras for their work with Casablanca units?

What about the AVCHD format - anyone using camera with this format and is it compatible with Renommee or other units?

I was considering the Panasonic AG-HMC150 Professional 3-CCD Handheld AVCCAM camcorder - which uses the AVCHD technology and high-capacity SD memory cards

thanks Tim for your input too - I am studying the different formats you talked about

Quite frankly, I am concerned about going tapeless - how to archive, expensive cards, what if they corrupt, etc.

any feedback or personal experience with tapless cams is appreciated

Kim Williamson
Blue Goose Productions

I personally have not made the switch, but several of my colleagues have with glowing reviews.

I know that Sony and Panasonic have cameras that can use both the card and tape simultaneously. This may help ease the fear of going to the card only. I know the Sony model is the FX1000. Whether it is compatible with MS, I am not sure.

Hello Kim,

I have a Panasonic HMC 150 arriving tomorrow and will be able to do some testing with it. However my editor is under the weather at the moment and I might not be able to feed and Cards into it for a while. But I will let you know what I think of it. I have talked with several professional who use it regularly and they seem to love it and the file system of storing scenes.

Getting it into the Bogart System is the next test and also from reports of others, it is supposed to work well too. Chet Davis has some excerpts of some Panny HMC150 SD card scenes on his web site and they look very nice. I am very excited about getting into High Definition with the Pansonic Solid State HMC 150 as I have been shooting with a DVX 100 for several years and this will be a nice upgrade for me.....yet keeping it very similar to what i'm used to already.

thanks guys for the input, this is sooooo helpful .... I love this forum!

Jim, will await your review of the Panny 150 and how it works with your Bogart system.

Anyone else care to offer any more information on cams to upgrade to?

Kim

Thanks, this is very helpful information

Kim

I will just caution, I strongly recommend against buying a cam or an editor for that matter on intended or promised future features, irregardless of whether you hear it word of mouth from another user or the company itself.

I am not specifically referring to the third generation line of MS editors (S4000Pro, S4100, S2000) although they certainly fully qualify as not coming close to their ballyhood capabilities with their current software, but for promotional promises and advertising hype in general.

The term "vaporware" is not new, but refers to announced software and features that never actually come into being to give you the promised capabilities.

Buying into vaporware with cold, hard cash is a path of wasted money, frustration and disappointment and I recommend you keep your money in your pocket until the tool or software is released and it shows it can perform as hyped before actually investing in it with real money.

In your specific case Kim you want to make sure the specific cam you plan to purchase actually works and works well with the system you have.

In particular with a small company like MS that has limited resources if you buy a cam that ends up not working well with the editor you are many times just flat out out of luck forever.

There have been specific Canon models that never were made to work with some of the second generation editors and there are JVC units, specifically using the 720p format that do not work with the second generation line OR the new third generation line, so I advice careful research for real world compatibility between a specific cam and editor before committing to one or the other and again, real world, not vaporware promises of assumed compatibilty and capability.

I am currently an owner of ONE tapeless camera in my arsenal. It is the HF S10 by CANON. This camera is superb due to the large optics which is not found on consumer-level cameras. I can import better via the BOGART SE side via the RECORD window's USB icon with the current software rather than MEDIA MANAGER. So, AVCHD style camera SHOULD all work in the AVCHD codec. The quality is pristine.

YES...certain flash cards are expensive, others are not. YES.....static electricity can burn out a card with a project. YES....you can have one corrupt I-frame which can knock out your entire GOP stream. YES...some cards are so tiny that they can be lost like a postage stamp. THEN.......TAPE.......shreds=headclogs. YES...HEADS clog....causing dropouts. YES....tape stretches effecting the pitch when used on different decks. YES.....transport systems for tape MUST be maintained and cleaned. TAPE has a physical shelf-life. Hard Drives and Flash Cards have mechanical issues. HUmm..........


However, I am still a big fan of tape and miss my CANON HV-30 HD tape video camera. I have noticed that with this new solid state format camera I purchased, I am keeping projects all over the place in regards to archiving. I have projects on the main HD, USB sticks, SD cards and lastly MTS files on standard a DVD-R's. SO, I am just ending up at the present time archiving in HD back to HDVtape for the future when I can burn Blu-ray. Hopefully, when Media Manager is finally exporting properly, I can convert the archives to the various listed formats for the internet, YOU TUBE etc. in the HD format.

The bottom line for ME is tapeless formatting from my CANON HF S10 ends up on tape. Sometimes I import the AVCHD into the "S4000 and EXPORT to HD tape via the FINISH window...then I import into the Solitaire Plus to use CB PAINT which is not supported as of yet in the "S" series.

Now, don't get me wrong. Tapeless has distinct advantages for removing files, selecting playlists, etc. directly from the camera's LCD screen. Tapeless is the future and we can't fight it. Tapeless technology is one of the touted benefits of the Generation 3 Casablancas. The developers are working on all types of CODECS at this time.

HOWEVER.... It is the storage
and workflow that I am addressing here for the present.

I also own the XH A1S, the much improved camera over my prior XHA-1 Canon. Though this is a tape camera, I will probably purchase an external-type HD (SONY?) so as to have a HYBRID system. In this case, I will have to make sure that the CODEC from the external drive is compatible with my "S" model so as not to waste money on the drive itself.

I'm using the Sony HDR-500V. It is great we are even using it at weddings to take 8 meg still shots at the same time you are shooting video. My wife is a photographer and she designs and album from the stills and a lot of the shots are shots that a photographer can't get. We've used them on two weddings and they are great.

Jim, Lou, Tim,

I hope everyone reads this thread. It is this kind of information from users of MS systems and who have used cams with various HD formats, that is invaluable and can save us (less experienced) from very costly mistakes when investing in our edit suites and cameras. Whew! A lot to think about and keep an eye on!

I did not know that the 720p format was not compatible with MS systems

I will be producing a new weekly Sunday morning show for local LPTV station - "Sunday Morning on the Guadelupe" (guadelupe river in the hill country of Texas).

It will be a human interest series, arts, interesting people, a little history of the area, science... etc. - I will let you know how it turns out. I am probably way underestimating the work load, and must be mad to do this .... but as we say down here .... "GERONIMO!!!!"

Kim Williamson
Blue Goose Productions

thank you all so much.

Kim Williamson
Blue Goose Productions